Anyone who is experienced with wine and/or CrossOver

moniec15 · Post by **moniec15** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 3:05 pm

I am on a Macbook 4,1 with 4GB ram and X3100 GPU running 10.5.6, VMware Fusion 2.0.2 and CxGames 7.2.

I am trying to get Runes of Magic to run, and I think it has something to do with wine.

I tried installing and running this game in win2k, winxp, and vista bottles and all yeilded the same result (the pic). I am not running any additional commands to the application (-dx8, -noshaders, etc).

I have also tried tweaking the Direct3d stuff in the registry to no avail.

Here is something interesting though, I keep hearing that it is a hardware problem (that X3100 on Mac wont support the game), but when I tried running the game in VMware (Vista), it was black for about 5 min, then it took me the the EULA agreement screen but there was no text in the box (where the EULA agreement should have been. I couldnt get past this box though because my entire system lagged so bad, but it seems like if somehow there was a way to configure the way CxGames processes these graphics (via wine maybe?) in a way similar to the way my other vista emulator did, there might be a way to get this game to run successfully.

Thanks in advanced!

Here is what I see when I start the game. Its missing all the 3D elements.

Here is my reg config.

vitamin · Post by **vitamin** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 3:53 pm

moniec15 wrote:I am on a Macbook 4,1 and CxGames 7.2.

Then why don't you ask Codeweavers instead?

moniec15 · Post by **moniec15** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 4:40 pm

I asked them at the same time I am aksing the wine community. I figured, you guys would know more about tweaking wine than they would. That is, assuming this is a wine problem (which I think it is). Do you have any clue as to what the prob could be?

austin987 · Post by **austin987** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 5:59 pm

On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 4:40 PM, moniec15 <[email protected]> wrote:

I asked them at the same time I am aksing the wine community. I figured, you guys would know more about tweaking wine than they would. That is, assuming this is a wine problem (which I think it is). Do you have any clue as to what the prob could be?

Poor video drivers

--
-Austin

moniec15 · Post by **moniec15** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 6:11 pm

Is there a work around? I know the latest X3100 drivers for PC from Intel's website support this game (and I would be real curious to try running this game via bootcamp prior to installing these new driver updates), but is there a way to tweek wine to make it think I have the drivers, or to process the graphics in a way that my GPU can handle it (assuming that the driver problem is the cause of all this).

Is it true that when it comes to driver updates, you have to wait for Apple to release them, usually in a form of an update? So I couldnt, as I would on a pc, find drivers compatible or superior to the latest ones released by Intel online, download them, and install them myself?

vitamin · Post by **vitamin** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 6:27 pm

moniec15 wrote:Is there a work around? I know the latest X3100 drivers for PC from Intel's website support this game

You can forget about playing any modernish game on any intel GPU. They are junk and drivers even worse then ATI was 5+ years ago.

rwoodsmall · Post by **rwoodsmall** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 9:09 pm

If you're using CodeWeavers, they're very responsive - their compatibility list has decent forums for supported products.

If you're using Wine built from source, there are a number of caveats, namely, you'll almost certainly need to use a BETA X11 server distributed from the Xquartz folks. This work will probably make it into the X server distributed with Mac OS X from Apple, but it is in beta. Again: beta. There are dragons there, and it may pay to stick with CrossOver if you already have a license or aren't comfortable with beta software and compiling Wine.

(Hopefully) long-ish Mac OS X+Wine forum post discussing some of the caveats and workarounds here...

Your onboard Intel GPU may or may not have enough oomph to run your game. I have the same machine you have, Intel X3100 and all, but mostly run older RPGs and a few FPSes. Framerate is not great - in fact, it's downright miserable in some cases - but it does the job for me. RoM lists the X3100 as supported, but recall that you're doing a Direct3D to OpenGL translation in flight. The AppDB page also lists the application as not working, so you may just be out of luck. Hate to be the bearer of bad news, but I hope this helps at least somewhat!

-ryan

tparker · Post by **tparker** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 9:15 pm

On Wed, 2009-03-11 at 21:09 -0500, rwoodsmall wrote:

Your onboard Intel GPU may or may not have enough oomph to run your game. I have the same machine you have, Intel X3100

Just sharing in case it's useful, my son's computer has an on board
Intel 3100 and in Windows he plays WoW, City of Heroes, and several
other games. The video settings have to be all the way down but they do
play well enough. I do not know how the Windows and Linux drivers for
the card compare, though.

James McKenzie · Post by **James McKenzie** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 9:45 pm

moniec15 wrote:

I am on a Macbook 4,1 with 4GB ram and X3100 GPU running 10.5.6, VMware Fusion 2.0.2 and CxGames 7.2.

I am trying to get Runes of Magic to run, and I think it has something to do with wine.

The problem is not with poor video drivers, that is for Linux. The
problem is that OpenGL 1.3 is not supported in a released version of
X11/XQuartz and most modern games rely on several functions being
present. There is a quite lengthy topic on Wine Forums about the 2.3.3
beta and how to get these functions to work. However, I will add that
this is NOT release quality work and your results may vary from not
being able to use Wine at all to everything working better than you
expect.

As to the program not working with CrossOver Mac/CrossOver Games, please
go to CodeWeavers and advise them. They do monitor these lists, but do
not provide support here for their products. Something I will advise is
to try the game in CrossOver Office if it is a Legacy game, like dOOm.

James McKenzie

moniec15 · Post by **moniec15** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 9:56 pm

Thanks for the responses guys! Yeah, I used to play WoW on this laptop too. I even played FFxi via VMwF. Not to mention I have read that for PC users updating the drivers for the X3100 are able to play games that have DirectX10. I know the hardware can handle this game (or maybe I am just hoping very strongly), but I dont know...

@Rwoodsmall

Thanks for all the great info. I read the thread you directed me to, and I am so clueless. I think you might be our (I speak for the RoM Mac/Linux community that has been trying to get this game playable) hope. I haven't heard back from codeweavers, but I think you might actually be a better means of nailing down the problem. Since we have the same system (assuming you too are running 10.5.6 and have 4GB ram) you could set the record straight that, utilizing the tools currently available to us (wine, CxG/M, VMwF, etc), Mac/Linux users, up to and including systems such as the Macbook 4,1, can not run games utilizing graphics such as RoM. If you cant get it to run on your system, not because the software to do so isnt available or too time consuming or difficult to figure out, but because the hardware just wont support it, so be it. But it makes me wonder how the same machine running a different OS can successfully run the same piece of software.

Of course the option to run these games via bootcamp is always available, and I have heard that the game does run fine under bootcamp, but for the same reason we even have wine today is the reason I would like to see our Mac's hardware reach its full potential and run software such as RoM.

Please help me understand a few things if can. Lets say, that the problem has something to do with the drivers right. Can wine emulate an environment so as to be able to install new drivers into the emulated environment? Is it possible to download the new Intel drivers for the X3100, install them into a wine environment, then within that environment run the game? If this isnt possible, could wine simply decrease the quality or strain the game puts on the hardware?

moniec15 · Post by **moniec15** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 10:10 pm

James McKenzie wrote:moniec15 wrote:
I am on a Macbook 4,1 with 4GB ram and X3100 GPU running 10.5.6, VMware Fusion 2.0.2 and CxGames 7.2.

I am trying to get Runes of Magic to run, and I think it has something to do with wine.

The problem is not with poor video drivers, that is for Linux. The
problem is that OpenGL 1.3 is not supported in a released version of
X11/XQuartz and most modern games rely on several functions being
present. There is a quite lengthy topic on Wine Forums about the 2.3.3
beta and how to get these functions to work. However, I will add that
this is NOT release quality work and your results may vary from not
being able to use Wine at all to everything working better than you
expect.

As to the program not working with CrossOver Mac/CrossOver Games, please
go to CodeWeavers and advise them. They do monitor these lists, but do
not provide support here for their products. Something I will advise is
to try the game in CrossOver Office if it is a Legacy game, like dOOm.

James McKenzie

Ahhhh ok thanks for the info. Very very interesting... So an openGL problem. Well the only reason I thought the issue had something to do with wine is because CxG uses wine to handle its graphics. Like I said, I got two different results using CxG and VMwF and knowing that the hardware does support the game, I assumed that if wine's rendering could be tweeked, everything would be all good.

I actually am not running wine as a standalone, as I am sure you can tell I am a noob to all this.

I want to put emphasis on the fact that I have sent inquires into codeweavers, but I just figured you guys would know wine better than they would, and could best let me know if there was a fix in wine I could make to get the game running (I am under the assumption, and have a hunch that there is).

Thanks so much for your responses, you guys are really helpful!

James McKenzie · Post by **James McKenzie** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 10:54 pm

moniec15 wrote:

James McKenzie wrote:

moniec15 wrote:

I am on a Macbook 4,1 with 4GB ram and X3100 GPU running 10.5.6, VMware Fusion 2.0.2 and CxGames 7.2.

I am trying to get Runes of Magic to run, and I think it has something to do with wine.

The problem is not with poor video drivers, that is for Linux. The
problem is that OpenGL 1.3 is not supported in a released version of
X11/XQuartz and most modern games rely on several functions being
present. There is a quite lengthy topic on Wine Forums about the 2.3.3
beta and how to get these functions to work. However, I will add that
this is NOT release quality work and your results may vary from not
being able to use Wine at all to everything working better than you
expect.

As to the program not working with CrossOver Mac/CrossOver Games, please
go to CodeWeavers and advise them. They do monitor these lists, but do
not provide support here for their products. Something I will advise is
to try the game in CrossOver Office if it is a Legacy game, like dOOm.

James McKenzie

Ahhhh ok thanks for the info. Very very interesting... So an openGL problem. Well the only reason I thought the issue had something to do with wine is because CxG uses wine to handle its graphics. Like I said, I got two different results using CxG and VMwF and knowing that the hardware does support the game, I assumed that if wine's rendering could be tweeked, everything would be all good.

I actually am not running wine as a standalone, as I am sure you can tell I am a noob to all this.

I want to put emphasis on the fact that I have sent inquires into codeweavers, but I just figured you guys would know wine better than they would, and could best let me know if there was a fix in wine I could make to get the game running (I am under the assumption, and have a hunch that there is).

Thanks so much for your responses, you guys are really helpful!

I just read through the other thread mentioned in rwoodsmall's message
in this thread. The suggestions made are not for noobs. I am trying to
get a copy of Wine for the Mac 1.1.16 compiled on my system uploaded to
good-day.net. I have to look at another system and see if the
information I need is there.

For those who are willing, the Release Candidate for XQuartz 2.3.3 is
available, however, this may break your installation of MacOSX in ways
that are not expected. Please use with care.

James McKenzie

rwoodsmall · Post by **rwoodsmall** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 10:57 pm

@moniec15

Your best bet - right now at least - is probably to run the game in Parallels Desktop or VMware Fusion. Of course, you've got to have a Windows license, and you're running a completely separate environment. And they're not free, so... there's that.

The AppDB page for the game (http://appdb.winehq.org/objectManager.p ... n&iId=8157) is currently listed as "garbage," which means it simply doesn't work. CodeWeaver's CrossOver products are based on Wine, so chances are if it doesn't work in one, it won't work in the other. And right now, at least, if it doesn't work with Wine on Linux, there's probably no chance of it working with Wine on Mac OS X.

-ryan

moniec15 · Post by **moniec15** » Thu Mar 12, 2009 9:29 am

You guys are awesome!

@James
What would you advise me do? I would really like to help as best I can because I really want to see this game up and running within a non-Windows environment, but given my limited knowledge and experience, I dont know how much help I could be.

@Ryan
I was actually considering getting Parallels (I posted to their forums asking if their OS emulator would support RoM) and already have VMwF and CrossoverGames (both of them the latest versions, refer back to my original post) but no dice.

I do have a valid vista license, but can you explain why the game should work in these separate OS environments as opposed to using something like wine or CxG? Here is my current discussion with VMware (http://communities.vmware.com/message/1196900#1196900), and I havent heard anything back from Codeweavers.

Codeweavers information regarding the game is outdated. I recently submitted information regarding the game and am not sure if they updated their database.

I would just like a solid idea as to why it doesnt work, thats all. Is it hardware, software, drivers, what? Once it is pinpointed down, finding a solution should be easier. We just have to convince someone out there who is good at solving these sort of problems that their time invested into getting this game to run would be well spent.

Just curious, what RPGs are you playing on your Mac? Have you checked out RoM?

sag47 · Post by **sag47** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 8:12 pm

I installed RoM in attempt to get it working and after a couple hours of configuration I could not get it to work much better than it did from the start. Ofc the menu screen doesn't show up and I even tried manually going into the RoM config files and setting everything to their base settings to ensure there were no video problems interfering but to no avail.

There must be a Windows component missing in Wine that needs to be installed to make up for functionality (along the lines of something like comdlg32, though wine has that).

I'd say the best bet on figuring out why this app is not working is to use Microsoft Debugging Tools for Windows to monitor the RoM process to see if anything fails or whatever.

http://www.microsoft.com/whdc/devtools/ ... llx86.mspx

I personally don't have much experience programming on Windows so I don't really know how to use their tools. Maybe someone who does know can do it.

~SAM~

moniec15 · Post by **moniec15** » Wed Mar 18, 2009 1:32 pm

Thanks for the update Sam!

Could you post your computer's stats and how you were trying to run the game? Perhaps sharing this information will provide someone more experienced a better insight into what went wrong in your case.

Here is an interesting tidbit. So this game runs fine on Linux (http://appdb.winehq.org/objectManager.p ... &iId=14853).

How can we now get this to run on Mac? I am in the process of downloading all the stuff sp, Michi, and Andreas Marschall used to get it to work on their systems, but am not sure if it will work since I am on OS 10.5.6. Anyone know whether or not downloading what they used should work on OSX?

Almost there guys!

James Mckenzie · Post by **James Mckenzie** » Wed Mar 18, 2009 1:55 pm

moniec15 <[email protected]> wrote on March 18th:

Sent: Mar 18, 2009 11:32 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [Wine] Re: Anyone who is experienced with wine and/or CrossOver

Thanks for the update Sam!

Could you post your computer's stats and how you were trying to run the game? Perhaps sharing this information will provide someone more experienced a better insight into what went wrong in your case.

Here is an interesting tidbit. So this game runs fine on Linux (http://appdb.winehq.org/objectManager.p ... &iId=14853).

How can we now get this to run on Mac? I am in the process of downloading all the stuff sp, Michi, and Andreas Marschall used to get it to work on their systems, but am not sure if it will work since I am on OS 10.5.6. Anyone know whether or not downloading what they used should work on OSX?

Almost there guys!

The key piece of the puzzle is XQuartz. Until 2.3.3 is released, I would not rely on anything in the package nor would I build against it, except for testing purposes. This is a hard learned lesson where a release candidate had code in it but the final release did not.

James McKenzie

moniec15 · Post by **moniec15** » Wed Mar 18, 2009 2:54 pm

Hey James, I dont know what that means

I downloaded and installed X11(Xquartz) 2.3.2 from Apple yesterday, and am in the process of installing Wine so that I can start trying to test this, but you are saying that only when Xquartz 2.3.3 is made available for us Mac users is when we will be able to play this game?

Do you know why this is?

James Mckenzie · Post by **James Mckenzie** » Wed Mar 18, 2009 4:08 pm

moniec15 <[email protected]> wrote on March 18th:

Hey James, I dont know what that means I downloaded and installed X11(Xquartz) 2.3.2 from Apple
yesterday, and am in the process of installing Wine so that I can start trying to test this, but
you are saying that only when Xquartz 2.3.3 is made available for us Mac users is when we will be
able to play this game?

XQuartz 2.3.2 still does not implement features required by some programs. It appears that this game is one of them. XQuartz 2.3.3 supposedly will implement the missing features.

Do you know why this is?

No. However, I think this was a decision by Apple to not support Server 1.4/1.6 which implemented these features due to the amount of time it would take in order to meet the release schedule for Leopard. I fully expect to see XQuartz 2.4.x to add more features from OpenGL and to allow more programs that rely on those features to run on the MacOSX Operating Sytem. I don't have any idea when this will happen.

At the present time 2.3.3 is on its second release test version (2.3.3rc2), but I would not implement this product for any reason other than to run tests against it. 2.3.3rc1 had some problems running OpenGL code that exists in Wine.

As to the reason that OpenGL is not enabled is to prevent crashes when unimplemented features are encountered. Read through other forum postings for an idea of programs that run 'just fine' on Linux but crash on MacOSX. I have one, dOOm95, a legacy game from the early Windows days that will not run on compiled Wine but will on CrossOver for Mac. It appears that CodeWeavers found the missing pieces and implemented them. Of course, these pieces are not Wine code, so they were not ported back into the Wine base. I applaude the folks at CodeWeavers for doing so, and they may have fed them back to the XQuartz project.

James McKenzie

moniec15 · Post by **moniec15** » Wed Mar 18, 2009 6:20 pm

Well that is very interesting. Is that why I am getting the "Direct3D does not match requirements" and "Direct3D interface does not exist" errors when I try to launch this game in wine 1.1.17?

This is what I see in the terminal after the program closes:
fixme:actctx:parse_assembly_elem wrong version for assembly manifest: 8.0.50608.0 / 8.0.50727.762
fixme:actctx:parse_manifest_buffer failed to parse manifest L"C:\\Program Files\\ROM\\Runes of Magic\\Microsoft.VC80.CRT\\Microsoft.VC80.CRT.manifest"
fixme:actctx:parse_depend_manifests Could not find dependent assembly L"Microsoft.VC80.CRT"
err:wgl:opengl_error No OpenGL support compiled in.
err:d3d:WineD3D_CreateFakeGLContext Can't find a suitable iPixelFormat
err:d3d:InitAdapters Failed to get a gl context for default adapter
err:d3d:WineDirect3DCreate Direct3D9 is not available without opengl

I thought this would be something I could easily fix by going in and changing some settings somewhere. But you are saying that these are a result from XQuartz?

moniec15 · Post by **moniec15** » Thu Mar 19, 2009 11:11 am

I was told that it is the useGLSL string in the Direct3D key of the registry that was causing the blue screen. Deleting it, or changing it to "enabled" gets rid of the blue screen on the CrossOver Games nightly build 3-16-2009. However in the nightly build 3-18-2009 pressing the invisible "accept" button causes the program to crash.

What invisible "accept" button you ask?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q68vTUYd5lo