WOW "fixes"

[Jim Hall]

I've run across the following two articles on the wow wiki. The first link
is the general page for Linux/Wine. The sound and voice chat is what I'm
most interested in about the second link. Can anyone comment on how current
and useful these tips are? It's nice to know that Blizzard knows about and
actually seems to "care" about Linux users, but I really do NOT want to
break anything because of misinformation.

http://www.wowwiki.com/Linux/Wine

http://www.wowwiki.com/Linux/Wine/Misc

Thanks,
Jim
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[Tomas Carnecky]

Jim Hall wrote:

and useful these tips are? It's nice to know that Blizzard knows about and
actually seems to "care" about Linux users, but I really do NOT want to

WoWWiki is maintained by volunteers, not by Blizzard. Given Blizzards
past history, they definitely don't care about Linux users. They
tolerate us but they don't care about us.

tom

[Paul Johnson]

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On Thursday 20 March 2008 01:29:15 pm Jim Hall wrote:

I've run across the following two articles on the wow wiki. The first link
is the general page for Linux/Wine. The sound and voice chat is what I'm
most interested in about the second link. Can anyone comment on how current
and useful these tips are? It's nice to know that Blizzard knows about and
actually seems to "care" about Linux users, but I really do NOT want to
break anything because of misinformation.

http://www.wowwiki.com/Linux/Wine

http://www.wowwiki.com/Linux/Wine/Misc

I would encourage them to link to the appdb and submit their findings there
instead of making a seperate resource for it.

- --
Paul Johnson
[email protected]
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[vitamin]

I would encourage them to link to the appdb and submit their findings there
instead of making a seperate resource for it.

That is exactly what did not work because of the horrid AppDB interface. So no, people need to keep information where it's easily maintainable and readable.

[DARKGuy .]

On 3/21/08, vitamin <[email protected]> wrote:

Paul Johnson wrote:

I would encourage them to link to the appdb and submit their findings

there

instead of making a seperate resource for it.

That is exactly what did not work because of the horrid AppDB interface. So
no, people need to keep information where it's easily maintainable and
readable.

Yeah I agree, something like "user-submitted" tips & tricks...
register -> post tip & trick -> pass review -> show on game's appdb
page.

Some might not like to put their findings on the comments, since...
well, it's for comments, I wouldn't put it there at least, but in a
more "concrete" place.

[Paul Johnson]

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On Thursday 20 March 2008 10:36:25 pm DARKGuy . wrote:

On 3/21/08, vitamin <[email protected]> wrote:

Paul Johnson wrote:

I would encourage them to link to the appdb and submit their findings

there

instead of making a seperate resource for it.

That is exactly what did not work because of the horrid AppDB interface.
So no, people need to keep information where it's easily maintainable and
readable.

Yeah I agree, something like "user-submitted" tips & tricks...
register -> post tip & trick -> pass review -> show on game's appdb
page.

You're describing how the appdb works in it's present form right now.

Some might not like to put their findings on the comments, since...
well, it's for comments, I wouldn't put it there at least, but in a
more "concrete" place.

Why not?

- --
Paul Johnson
[email protected]
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[David Gerard]

On 21/03/2008, Paul Johnson <[email protected]> wrote:

On Thursday 20 March 2008 10:36:25 pm DARKGuy . wrote:

On 3/21/08, vitamin <[email protected]> wrote:

Paul Johnson wrote:

That is exactly what did not work because of the horrid AppDB interface.
So no, people need to keep information where it's easily maintainable and
readable.

Yeah I agree, something like "user-submitted" tips & tricks...
register -> post tip & trick -> pass review -> show on game's appdb
page.

You're describing how the appdb works in it's present form right now.

If people are not using it, and are instead doing it somewhere else,
then this suggests something could be improved about the AppDB
interface (and will need to be for 1.0).


- d.

[Paul Johnson]

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On Friday 21 March 2008 05:27:52 am David Gerard wrote:

On 21/03/2008, Paul Johnson <[email protected]> wrote:

On Thursday 20 March 2008 10:36:25 pm DARKGuy . wrote:

On 3/21/08, vitamin <[email protected]> wrote: Yeah I agree, something like "user-submitted" tips & tricks...
register -> post tip & trick -> pass review -> show on game's appdb
page.

You're describing how the appdb works in it's present form right now.

If people are not using it, and are instead doing it somewhere else,
then this suggests something could be improved about the AppDB
interface (and will need to be for 1.0).

I understand that, I was trying to prod DARKGuy into providing useful
feedback, since what the AppDB does and what he describes aren't different.

- --
Paul Johnson
[email protected]
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[DARKGuy .]

What I meant is, well, in order to submit some tips & tricks you have
to --create-- a new version (log in to become an application
maintainer) and pass through the whole process in order to just add
some quick tips. For example I just read some of the versions in
Half-Life 2, and I found useful stuff (well, maybe not for me 'cause I
don't have it, but some might do) "hidden" in the description of those
versions, which could be well-placed in the frontpage of the current
app's version. Comments also count too, and can help for other
versions.

My point here is, that for giving some quick tips & tricks for making
the game/app run better/faster under WINE you need to create a new
version, and other people who might want to have a "broader view" of
those, can't.


On Sat, Mar 22, 2008 at 10:25 AM, Paul Johnson <[email protected]> wrote:

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On Friday 21 March 2008 05:27:52 am David Gerard wrote:

On 21/03/2008, Paul Johnson <[email protected]> wrote:

On Thursday 20 March 2008 10:36:25 pm DARKGuy . wrote: You're describing how the appdb works in it's present form right now.

If people are not using it, and are instead doing it somewhere else,
then this suggests something could be improved about the AppDB
interface (and will need to be for 1.0).

I understand that, I was trying to prod DARKGuy into providing useful
feedback, since what the AppDB does and what he describes aren't different.

- --

Paul Johnson
[email protected]

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[tparker]

David Gerard wrote:

If people are not using it, and are instead doing it somewhere else,
then this suggests something could be improved about the AppDB
interface (and will need to be for 1.0).

I have submitted to the AppDB multiple times for both WoW and City of
Heroes/Villains. Each time I made sure to follow the directions for the
submission and everything seemed okay when I sent it in. I never saw any of the
submissions show up in the DB even though I had made sure that they added new
information, were using current versions of the games and Wine, a linux distro
that didn't have a listing yet, etc. so that I was adding useful info and not a
'me too!'.

In each case after several weeks I would get an email that said my submission
had been removed from the DB but said nothing about why so I have no clue if I
did something wrong in the interface, misunderstood the type of information I
should have included, or who knows what else. As a newish linux/wine user and a
definite end-user, not a programmer, the 9th or 10th time that happened I just
stopped submitting. Now I just try and help with game related posts on my distro
forum (Ubuntu), a general user forum (linuxquestions.org), or this list instead.

Tricia

[David Gerard]

On 26/03/2008, tparker <[email protected]> wrote:

David Gerard wrote:

If people are not using it, and are instead doing it somewhere else,
then this suggests something could be improved about the AppDB
interface (and will need to be for 1.0).

I have submitted to the AppDB multiple times for both WoW and City of
Heroes/Villains. Each time I made sure to follow the directions for the
submission and everything seemed okay when I sent it in. I never saw any of the
submissions show up in the DB even though I had made sure that they added new
information, were using current versions of the games and Wine, a linux distro
that didn't have a listing yet, etc. so that I was adding useful info and not a
'me too!'.
In each case after several weeks I would get an email that said my submission
had been removed from the DB but said nothing about why so I have no clue if I
did something wrong in the interface, misunderstood the type of information I
should have included, or who knows what else. As a newish linux/wine user and a
definite end-user, not a programmer, the 9th or 10th time that happened I just
stopped submitting. Now I just try and help with game related posts on my distro
forum (Ubuntu), a general user forum (linuxquestions.org), or this list instead.

So the AppDB is an information black hole and actually needs to be
worked around, then?


- d.

[Dan Kegel]

On Wed, Mar 26, 2008 at 10:27 AM, tparker <[email protected]> wrote:

I have submitted to the AppDB multiple times for both WoW and City of
Heroes/Villains. Each time I made sure to follow the directions for the
submission and everything seemed okay when I sent it in. I never saw any of the
submissions show up in the DB even though I had made sure that they added new
information, were using current versions of the games and Wine, a linux distro
that didn't have a listing yet, etc. so that I was adding useful info and not a
'me too!'.

In each case after several weeks I would get an email that said my submission
had been removed from the DB but said nothing about why

That's too bad. I've asked the WoW appdb maintainer to comment.

As a maintainer for Photoshop and a few other apps, I do find
that it's easy to not notice test data submissions, so sometimes
I don't approve them as quickly as I should. I always try to
explain why when I reject or remove stuff.
- Dan

[Jim]

That's too bad. I've asked the WoW appdb maintainer to comment.

As a maintainer for Photoshop and a few other apps, I do find
that it's easy to not notice test data submissions, so sometimes
I don't approve them as quickly as I should. I always try to
explain why when I reject or remove stuff.
- Dan

I personally think the HowTo sections and such should be more like a Wiki and be updated by all. These sections often go out of date and become incorrect.

They should at least be flagged as outdated if the maintainer hasn't touched it within the last 10 releases--the same way that test data is. They should also be flagged if a linked bug is resolved. Of course if the DB entry for an app gets flagged a message should be sent to all of its maintainers. If none respond within a week or so, the application's entry becomes unmaintained (ie the maintainers are removed for not being maintainers).

Additionally there's a lot of test data with the three text fields filled in with "everything", "nothing", and "nothing" (everything works, nothing doesn't work, and everything was tested). It gets a platinum rating despite the fact every post prior to or after rated it much lower and expressed significant problems. These are the worst kinds of posts because they really don't give any useful information and serve to frustrate users who can't get an app working. All they know is that there is some unsubstantiated claims that it can be done.

I think that the suggestions expressed in other threads in the list, with respect to improving the rating system, are also very relevant and should be considered as well.

If time and resources permit I think it would be great to have these kinks worked out by 1.0 time--at least to what extent they can be.

[David Gerard]

On 26/03/2008, Jim <[email protected]> wrote:

I personally think the HowTo sections and such should be more like a Wiki and be updated by all. These sections often go out of date and become incorrect.

Yes. This avoids (b) the danger of a moderator as bottleneck (a) the
unhelpful AppDB interface. I'm reasonably technically able and I
frequently can't make sense of the patchwork quilt of alternating
"gold" and "garbage" with how-to tips randomly hidden behind them.

If time and resources permit I think it would be great to have these kinks worked out by 1.0 time--at least to what extent they can be.

Start a parallel replacement for AppDB, with a view to replacing it.


- d.

[Ben Lawrence]

I'm a super maintainer for WoW, so I may be able to help. If at all
possible, link to me what was rejected, or resubmit them. I'll look them
over and see if they meet the standards or not.

-BL

[hellork]

As a maintainer for several applications myself, I like the current AppDB interface but it does need a wiki section that is update-able by all. I would suggest putting it right below the "howto" section. The wiki would allow the self-policing, history and up-to-date information while still keeping the howto and comments intact.

As a further suggestion, I would put javascript validation code into the comment submission form that uses heuristics to detect spam or when a user submits a big error log and warns them to not do that.

Maybe restrict comments to 100 lines or so...