Wine Conformance Test on Windows 9x, how to report?

nachanon · Post by **nachanon** » Fri Jul 08, 2011 8:20 am

I've run two conformance test binary (winetest-latest and winetest-8cbb8cc38d01) on Microsoft Windows Me 4.90.3000,
both warned that Win9x was not supported, and I wouldn't be able to submit results.

The lastest one said that there were about 67 tests failed (some wscript and msi error dialog appeared during the test)
and it also said that there might be some problem with my configuration.
[this one got 6451 line of "Test failed"]

'8cbb8cc38d01' didn't say anything (and there was some regedit error dialog while testing).
[this one got 788 line of "Test failed"]

I've checked test.winehq.org and couldn't find any Win9x entry,
both Wine wiki and developer guide topic on Conformance Test didn't say anything about what to do after testing, or how to report the results.

So what should I do next?

vitamin · Post by **vitamin** » Fri Jul 08, 2011 8:44 am

nachanon wrote:I've run two conformance test binary (winetest-latest and winetest-8cbb8cc38d01) on Microsoft Windows Me 4.90.3000,
both warned that Win9x was not supported, and I wouldn't be able to submit results.

So what should I do next?

Nothing. Wine conformance tests no longer made to work on Win9x (which Win ME is). All errors you see on those platforms won't be fixed.

jjmckenzie · Post by **jjmckenzie** » Fri Jul 08, 2011 9:32 am

On Fri, Jul 8, 2011 at 6:44 AM, vitamin <[email protected]> wrote:

nachanon wrote:
I've run two conformance test binary (winetest-latest and winetest-8cbb8cc38d01) on Microsoft Windows Me 4.90.3000,
both warned that Win9x was not supported, and I wouldn't be able to submit results.

So what should I do next?
Nothing. Wine conformance tests no longer made to work on Win9x (which Win ME is). All errors you see on those
platforms won't be fixed.

The OP can fix the tests so they pass if they are so inclined, but the
Wine project is not tracking Windows9x/ME failures anymore. The
minimum version that the project does track is WindowsNT 4.0/XP/2000.
(Not certain about 4.0.)

James

Post by **DanKegel** » Fri Jul 08, 2011 10:18 am

The tests are just a means to an end... do you have a real app that used
to work, but doesn't anymore?

nachanon · Post by **nachanon** » Fri Jul 08, 2011 10:19 pm

Thanks.

(I noticed wine-1.3.15 changelog said eariler, that conformance tests won't support Win9x anymore.
But winetest-8cbb8cc38d01 was released on Jan-2011, two full month before 1.3.15)

So, since Win9x API conformance won't be monitored anymore, Win16 wouldn't too,
it's likely that two way left to get Win9x/Win16 apps working are posting in AppDB and reporting specific bug via bug report, for now.

Hoping that Wine project is not going to entirely drop win9x or win16 in near future.

I also would like to know that which version of the tests that's still known to run on Win9x too.

nachanon · Post by **nachanon** » Fri Jul 08, 2011 10:31 pm

DanKegel wrote:The tests are just a means to an end... do you have a real app that used
to work, but doesn't anymore?

Not exactly, but yes, I have dozens of Win9x and Win16 apps that are not likely to work with Wine,
since most were from the same publisher (DK Multimedia), from the same age (pre-2000),
have the same dependency (QuickTime 2.x, 16 and 32 bit),
and I've tested few of them (on Wine 1.1.x - 1.3.x), none works.

Only one I've got it posted on AppDB was My Amazing Human Body (DK, win32, depends on quicktime32)
which got a near-garbage rating by definition, quicktime issue.

Another one (not on AppDB yet), this one got a regression, "The Way Things Work 2.0" (DK, win16, depends on quicktime16)
program itself crashed, regression on installer (it works on wine 0.9.x) and quicktime issue.

and another few apps from that age (still not on AppDB too)
- I Love Science (DK), fails on cd detection and quicktime.
- Lion King Activity Center (Disney), fails on mci.
- Math Quest with Aladdin (Disney), fails on palette setting.

But since Wine Win9x support happened to cease faster than I expected,
I will try harder on posting every apps to AppDB and filing bug reports for all failures as fast as possible,
especially for apps mentioned above.

jjmckenzie · Post by **jjmckenzie** » Fri Jul 08, 2011 10:38 pm

On 7/8/11 8:31 PM, nachanon wrote:

DanKegel wrote:
The tests are just a means to an end... do you have a real app that used
to work, but doesn't anymore?
Not exactly, but yes, I have dozens of Win9x and Win16 apps that are not likely to work with Wine,
since most were from the same publisher (DK Multimedia), from the same age (pre-2000),
have the same dependency (QuickTime 2.x, 16 and 32 bit),
and I've tested few of them (on Wine 1.1.x - 1.3.x), none works.

Only one I've got it posted on AppDB was My Amazing Human Body (http://appdb.winehq.org/objectManager.p ... &iId=12458) (DK, win32, depends on quicktime32)
which got a near-garbage rating by definition, quicktime issue.

Another one (not on AppDB yet), this one got a regression, "The Way Things Work 2.0" (DK, win16, depends on quicktime16)
program itself crashed, regression on installer (it works on wine 0.9.x) and quicktime issue.

and another few apps from that age (still not on AppDB too)
- I Love Science (DK), fails on cd detection and quicktime.
- Lion King Activity Center (Disney), fails on mci.
- Math Quest with Aladdin (Disney), fails on palette setting.

But since Wine Win9x support happened to cease faster than I expected,
I will try harder on posting every apps to AppDB and filing bug reports for all failures as fast as possible,
especially for apps mentioned above.

Windows 9x support has not ended, just recording of conformance test
results against the base platform.

You have to file bug reports and the dependent programs have to exist
(somewhere) where they can be downloaded and tested against.

As to the regression, testing is in the eye of the beholder. If you
know which two versions the problem appeared in (and git is your friend
here as it can go WAY back in versions) and can run a regression test
and identify the 'bad' commits, then someone might be able to create a
proper fix that will allow those programs to function again in Wine.

However, if fixing Windows9x/ME BREAKS Windows NT or later
functionality, you may be at a loss for now.

This is spoken from MY understanding of Windows98/ME support and may be
totally incorrect.

James

nachanon · Post by **nachanon** » Sat Jul 09, 2011 1:19 am

jjmckenzie wrote:However, if fixing Windows9x/ME BREAKS Windows NT or later
functionality, you may be at a loss for now.

It likely that the case where Wine's fix of Win9x line breaks WinNT line,
occured when particular application that used to work on Win9x, breaks on WinXP (or NT).

So I just need to specify in the report that the application breaks the same way on WinXP or not,
so they will be able to keep that fixed behaviour out of NT/XP line, then make them available only when
Win95/98/Me was selected in Winecfg?

And if the app is working perfectly on WinXP without any compatibility mode (which most do worked),
there's likely one less thing to worry, right?, because it might be the correct behaviour on WinXP/NT too.

jjmckenzie · Post by **jjmckenzie** » Sat Jul 09, 2011 8:14 pm

On 7/8/11 11:19 PM, nachanon wrote:

jjmckenzie wrote:
However, if fixing Windows9x/ME BREAKS Windows NT or later
functionality, you may be at a loss for now.
It likely that the case where Wine's fix of Win9x line breaks WinNT line,
occured when particular application that used to work on Win9x, breaks on WinXP (or NT).

Not necessarily. However, if the program does not work under WindowsXP,
I would not expect it to do so in the initial setting for Wine's API
implementation which is to use the API/ABI from WindowsXP. You can
change this for a particular program to attempt to use the Windows98
API/ABI in winecfg.

So I just need to specify in the report that the application breaks the same way on WinXP or not,
so they will be able to keep that fixed behaviour out of NT/XP line, then make them available only when
Win95/98/Me was selected in Winecfg?

Yes.

And if the app is working perfectly on WinXP without any compatibility mode (which most do worked),
there's likely one less thing to worry, right?, because it might be the correct behaviour on WinXP/NT too.

Yes. And if the program does not work with the Wine duplication of
WindowsXP API/ABI and it works with WindowsXP without a compatibility
setting, then a bug report needs to be filed with as much information as
possible. If it does not work with WindowsXP, then this may be a 'do it
yourself' fix as there is very few people interested in fixing/updating
the Windows98 API/ABI 'stuff' in Wine. However, if this is a regression
from prior behaviour, then someone may be interested if their 'fix' or
API/ABI implementation broke working programs.

James

nachanon · Post by **nachanon** » Sun Jul 10, 2011 1:49 am

Okay, I'd better off to do it now.
Thanks, everyone.