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 Post Posted: Fri Oct 05, 2018 3:51 pm 
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Hello.


I've recently started a sort of hobby-project with the idea of "can old hardware be useful in 2018?"

The device in question is an old Sony VAIO PCG-SRX77(UC) Windows XP 800MHz laptop. Since XP is no longer officially supported and security is more of an issue I made it a Dual Operating System with the best Puppy Linux it could handle: Puppy Linux 5.2.5.

I installed WINE on both it and on the 2012 8GB RAM 2.6 GHz ASUS, version 1.5. It handles just about anything on the ASUS, such as the standalone Undertale and Foxtail, but not on the Sony.

Is a lack of RAM the problem?

I need some help getting started here; please excuse any question that might seem dumb- but I'm not sure where to begin here.

Thank you.


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 Post Posted: Fri Oct 05, 2018 4:04 pm 
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GusCE6 wrote:
Is a lack of RAM the problem?

There's really no way to know that from what you've told us, which notably leaves out how much RAM the old system has and what is actually going wrong.


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 Post Posted: Fri Oct 05, 2018 4:41 pm 
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GusCE6 wrote:
I've recently started a sort of hobby-project with the idea of "can old hardware be useful in 2018?"

The device in question is an old Sony VAIO PCG-SRX77(UC) Windows XP 800MHz laptop. Since XP is no longer officially supported and security is more of an issue I made it a Dual Operating System with the best Puppy Linux it could handle: Puppy Linux 5.2.5.


Probably no...
If that model has the stock 128 Mb... Then definitely a non-starter.
I'd reckon it would be hard to run much on this machine - bar perhaps a headless server.
That is not so much an old machine, as an ancient machine - by modern standards.

My cut off, for an old machine is P4-based, or Athlon-XP-based hardware with 512 Mb (+) RAM.
Anything lower spec'd then that, is more of a doorstop these days. :cry:

GusCE6 wrote:
I installed WINE on both it and on the 2012 8GB RAM 2.6 GHz ASUS, version 1.5. It handles just about anything on the ASUS, such as the standalone Undertale and Foxtail, but not on the Sony.

Is a lack of RAM the problem?


Yes, 128 Mb RAM will cause issues when running a plain X session. Let alone running Wine.

Version 1.5 of what? If it's Wine - then that's years out of support now.

Bob


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 Post Posted: Sun Oct 07, 2018 5:49 pm 
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I'm sorry about that...as I said, I'm new to this. I'll try to do better, honest!

The laptop is that Sony VAIO, and it is old. It has 256 MB RAM, and it has Puppy Linux 5.2.5 Lucid installed.

Wine does run. It has gotten some apps, including Notepad++, SoftMaker Office 2016 USB, the excellent QTWeb browser, and a few games running. But it has failed to run two games in particular, Gingertips' Foxtail and Undertale.

I am wondering why. They do run on the ASUS with the same exact Wine PET file installed.

A Swap file is mentioned in a specs app, but I've never seen it used.

Thanks!


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 Post Posted: Sun Oct 07, 2018 9:43 pm 
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256 MB is still very low; I'm impressed that anything runs on it. From what I've read, your graphics card uses shared video memory, i.e., system memory, and my guess is that games (and any graphics-intensive programs) are simply too much for it.


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 Post Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 2:36 pm 
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That's the strange part about it: what does run and doesn't run.

"Foxtail" for Windows needs 128MB RAM, "SVGA graphics," and 300MHz processing ability. I was told if the computer can run its Operating System, it can run the game. It never does, WINE or XP mode.

Now, another EXE game called "Inherit the Earth" DOES run, including when using WINE. It requires, among other things, 512 MB RAM (no typo there) and something like 1.6 GHz of processing speed. Again, it runs.

It also runs Softmaker FreeOffice 2016 USB, and the QTWeb browser.

What's going on here?


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 Post Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 5:53 pm 
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Post terminal output from trying to run Foxtail. https://wiki.winehq.org/FAQ#How_can_I_g ... tput.29.3F


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 Post Posted: Sat Oct 13, 2018 5:05 pm 
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Foxtail:

1) It is located on a USB stick. It is a “standalone” version, not Steam-online; it runs on public library computers without having ever been installed. Its location is:

“/mnt/sdc5/Foxtail_Offline/Foxtail_Offline/foxtail.exe”

Trying to run it with

“wine foxtail.exe”

results in:

“wine: cannot find L”C\\windows\\system32\\foxtail.exe”

I have been unable to redirect the path with “cd.” Whatever I try simply results in:

“bash: cd: /mnt/sdc5/Foxtail_Offline/Foxtail_Offline/foxtail(or foxtail.exe): No such file or directory”

Trying

“wine /mnt/sdc5/Foxtail_Offline/Foxtail_Offline/foxtail.exe”

results in the following error message:

“err:module:import_dll Loading library SDL2.dll (which is needed by L”Z:\\mnt\\sdc5\\Foxtail_Offline\\Foxtail_Offline\\foxtail.exe) failed (error c000007b).
err:module:LdrInitializeThunk Main exe initialization for L”Z:\\mnt\\sdc5\\Foxtail_Offline\\Foxtail_Offline\\foxtail.exe” failed, status c0000135“



Now, I’m assuming that WINE is independent and does NOT depend on or use installed Windows; if the Sony VAIO was not a Dual-Operating System but was instead a pure Puppy Linux 5.2.5 Lucid system- no XP anywhere!- WINE would work just as it’s doing now. This is vital for QTWeb and Firefox 40: if being run strictly on WINE and Puppy Linux then it should be safe and the 2001 Sony would be safe for Internet browsing. WINE therefore would be a very, very useful application indeed.

Foxtail normally installs a folder called “Foxtail” in the “AppData/Roaming” section on the ASUS; on the Sony it would normally be “AppData.” This folder has the “settings” file.

This is just a guess here, so check me on this one: WINE does NOT rely on the Windows part of the computer, but handles things itself. Judging by the two error messages at least part of the problem is my failure to “change directory” so Foxtail is not able to “use” files like SDL2.dll, which is in the same folder.

But all I had to do with the same game on the same USB stick using the same WINE installation (1.5.0) on the ASUS with its Puppy Linux 6.0.5 Tahrpup was choose the game’s EXE file with WINE’s file system, click, and it worked. No adjustments, nothing.

WINE does work on the Sony. It plays several games so far, as well as some XP applications such as Notepad, Notepad++, Pinball, Freecell, SoftMaker FreeOffice USB 2016, Firefox 40, and of course QTWeb browser. The more demanding game “Inherit the Earth” works. But no game that did not work before in XP mode works with WINE.

However- Foxtail does work on the ASUS in Windows 8 mode; it never worked on the Sony in XP mode. I’ve been assured that it should, but it doesn’t. It could be a fouled-up Operating System but how would that affect running it on WINE on Puppy Linux 5.2.5 Lucid?

Some crude tests indicate the Swap file does work, by the way- this with HTOP. The VLC Player, HTOP, Firefox, and Opera were all successfully run at the same time, as was Windows Firefox 40 with WINE, so RAM cannot be an issue here. The monitor showed this.


What is wrong here, or what am I doing wrong? For starters, what do I type in for the change directory?


If with help here I can get Foxtail running, we shall see about Undertale. Then, perhaps, games like Luxis and Puzzle Puppers, which require Windows 7 or higher? It’s thanks to WINE that the old Sony using Puppy Linux 5.2.5 Lucid can even be here; if it can get those games going too then it’s nothing less than phenomenal.


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 Post Posted: Sat Oct 13, 2018 9:51 pm 
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GusCE6 wrote:
This is just a guess here, so check me on this one: WINE does NOT rely on the Windows part of the computer, but handles things itself.

Correct. Wine is not meant to interact with a real Windows install at all, and people who try to do that run into problems.
Quote:
Judging by the two error messages at least part of the problem is my failure to “change directory” so Foxtail is not able to “use” files like SDL2.dll, which is in the same folder.

Yes. Instructions for how to install and run apps are at https://wiki.winehq.org/Wine_User%27s_G ... s_programs.
As for SDL2.dll, current Wine has its own implementation, and if you were using it, you would have to override the builtin version to use the version packaged with the app. But apparently you're not using anything near current...
Quote:
WINE installation (1.5.0)

1.5.0 is six years old and hasn't been supported in years. The current stable release is 3.0.3.


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 Post Posted: Sun Oct 14, 2018 4:40 pm 
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But why does WINE 1.5.0 run the games on the ASUS? It is the same exact PET file running the same exact games with a mere click.



What would be the most recent version of WINE for the laptop described above, one that would work well? Where would I download the PET file for it?

And what would I type in for the directory change? I can't seem to figure that one out as strange as that seems.


Thanks in advance!


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 Post Posted: Mon Oct 15, 2018 4:10 am 
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@GusCE6

You are using a version of Puppy Linux that is well out of the support window.
This is not to be recommended - as you won't get any security updates for your OS.

Can you actually run a modern web browser, on those systems?
This, after all, is the primary attack vector, for any Operating System, in modern times.

Ubuntu Tahr 6.0.5 is the earliest version of Puppy Linux that is still supported (and probably only till 2019 - since it is based on Ubuntu 14.04).

You may find that your game + Wine system RAM or VRAM overhead - is just too much for the (rather unspec'd) Sony laptop.
Unless the 2 systems have identical specifications, it is expected that there will be some variation between them.
My Ivy-bridge CPU+iGPU-based laptop will support a fraction of the games that my Core i7 Haswell + Nvidia 970M GPU does.

Without any terminal output, it's hard to say what is going wrong with your application.
You'd want to start it with something like:
Code:
wine start /unix /mnt/sdc5/Foxtail_Offline/Foxtail_Offline/foxtail.exe

This will setup a context for the application that includes the directory:
Code:
/mnt/sdc5/Foxtail_Offline/Foxtail_Offline/

As Windows looks in the present working directory, first, for executables and dynamic link libraries it requires.

To create a log file (in your HOME directory) you'd run something like:
Code:
wine start /unix /mnt/sdc5/Foxtail_Offline/Foxtail_Offline/foxtail.exe &>~/wine-1.5.0-log


Bob


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 Post Posted: Wed Oct 17, 2018 3:11 pm 
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I've tried installing Puppy Linux 6.0.5 Tahrpup on the Sony- it does install, you even go through the pages where you can choose the resolution (in this case 1024x768), but beyond that all you get is a black screen with that "underline cursor" in the upper right section. Nothing happens.

Now, Puppy Linux 7 Xenialpup (I think that's the name) installs, runs nicely...until you try to run a media player or browser like the built-in Palemoon. Then nothing as far as those apps are concerned; HTOP does NOT indicate excessive RAM useage. The built-in games and those "Office" apps do work fine, and installing WINE does work, but with no better results than on Puppy Linux 5.2.5 Lucid.


Puppy Linux is not vulnerable to viruses in the ways Windows is, luckily- that's why I use it to browse on that ancient laptop from 2001. I also only visit a few well-known sites in any case, and fixing Puppy Linux is quite easy if something does happen.



"You may find that your game + Wine system RAM or VRAM overhead - is just too much for the (rather unspec'd) Sony laptop.
Unless the 2 systems have identical specifications, it is expected that there will be some variation between them.
My Ivy-bridge CPU+iGPU-based laptop will support a fraction of the games that my Core i7 Haswell + Nvidia 970M GPU does."


This is where it gets weird- and I do mean weird. The laptop is a 2001 Sony VAIO with Windows XP/Puppy Linux 5.2.5 Lucid, a Dual-Operating System. It has an 800MHz processor, Intel Pentium 3 Integrated chip (so no SSE2), and 256 MB RAM. It has ample room for the games.

Now, Foxtail requires the following according to Gingertips itself:

OS: XP/7/8/10
Processor: Pentium II 300MHz
Memory: 128 MB RAM
Graphics: SVGA videoadapter
DirectX: Version 9.0
Storage: 100 MB available space


Since Sid Meier's Pirates! 2K does run- as do certain other games- DirectX 9.0 should not be an issue, be it using 3-D Analyze or Swiftshader 2.1. The rest should be within standards, and they assured me it should work. But it doesn't, be it with XP or while in Puppy Linux mode. It begins to fire up, then crashes in XP; with Puppy Linux nothing.


O.K, now here is the EXE version of the old MS-DOS game "Inherit the Earth." These are its specifications according to Steam:


OS: Windows XP / Vista / 7 / 8
Processor: 1.8 GHz Processor
Memory: 512 MB RAM
Graphics: 100% DirectX compatible graphics
DirectX: Version 9.0c
Storage: 600 MB available space
Sound Card: 100% DirectX compatible card or onboard sound


By itself it works great- except for the black screen. Drop in the Swiftshader 2.1 files and it works just fine, and here's the truly weird part: Swiftshader normally slows a game down because it is a "software solution." It had done this with other games I've used it on, not critically but quite a bit. In the case of "Inherit the Earth," a game which should be beyond the Sony in any case, it does no such thing- in fact, even in Fullscreen mode it plays nearly as well as on the 2012 8GB RAM 2.6GHz plays-World-of-Tanks-with-no-problem ASUS notebook!

In fact it plays great even when in Puppy Linux mode with WINE- one of the only games that does work!


I was able to install WINE when using Puppy Linux 7 Xenialpup on the Sony. It did handle some apps, so there was function. But NOT Foxtail or Undertale. Yet that same exact version of WINE, 1.5.0, did so splendidly on the ASUS with Puppy Linux 6.0.5 Tahrpup.

Another test: I uninstalled WINE 1.5.0, and installed 1.3.X (I don't remember exactly). It could handle Deepica and the Plumeboom games once Swiftshader was dropped in the folders and WINE was instructed to use them (natively) so the "DirectX 8" error message was gone. But Windows Firefox 40 crashed. With WINE 1.5.0 Firefox worked fine (as cherry wine, Conan O'Brien reference there), but Deepica and the Plumeboom games have "invisible" screens, just the frame. So that old FAQ was right: later versions may suddenly fail while even later ones get it right again.


Trying to create the LOG file seemed to work. But trying to start the game results in this:

err:start:wmain Option 'L"/mnt/sdc5/Foxtail_Offline/Foxtail_Offline/foxtail.exe"' not recognized.


Your second line gave this error message:

bash: (location again): No such file or directory. But that is where it is.


Quite maddening at times, no?


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 Post Posted: Wed Oct 17, 2018 4:17 pm 
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@GusCE6

That's just bread and butter. 8)

Looks like it's just insensitivity issues... The Windows (case-insensitive) path works, the UNIX (case-sensitive) one doesn't...
What's the output from:
Code:
find /mnt/sdc5 -iname "foxtail.exe"


Also what's the output from:
Code:
sudo lsblk -o HCTL,KNAME,MODEL,REV,FSTYPE,SIZE,UUID,LABEL,MOUNTPOINT'


Please can you use the forum Code:
Code:
...
tags for blocks of terminal commands+output...

Especially if you're going to write walls of text! :lol:
Although it is very laudable that you're managing to still run a P3 - in this age of disposable hardware!

Ta
Bob


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 Post Posted: Sat Oct 20, 2018 4:44 pm 
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Attempting to start the game (it’s in a different place now but your instructions are otherwise followed) results in these:


Code:
# wine start /unix /mnt/sda5/00_ASUS_Games/Foxtail_Offline/foxtail.exe



This was the result:

Code:
# err:module:load_builtin_dll failed to load .so lib for builtin L”winemp3.acm”: libmpg123.so.0: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory
fixme:win:EnumDisplayDevicesW (L”\\\\.\\DISPLAY1“,0,0x33f430,0x00000000), stub!
Xlib:  extension “GLX” missing on display “:0.0“.
err:wgl:X11DRV_WineGL_InitOpenglInfo  couldn’t initialize OpenGL, expect problems



(You can say that again.)

Gingetips sent me the file “settings.xml” which has the following code:


Code:
<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?>
<Settings>
   <Rendering>
      <RenderingHint>direct3d</RenderingHint>
   </Rendering>
</Settings>



This points the game to DirectX rather than OpenGL. Including it when using WINE has absolutely no effect here: the result is identical.



Trying this:


Code:
/mnt/sda5/00_ASUS_Games/Foxtail_Offline/



Results in:


Code:
bash: /mnt/sda5/00_ASUS_Games/Foxtail_Offline/: is a directory



Trying:

Code:
sudo lsblk -o HCTL,KNAME,MODEL,REV,FSTYPE,SIZE,UUID,LABEL,MOUNTPOINT’



Results in:

Code:
bash: sudo: command not found


Note: in case you mistakenly added that single quotation mark or left one out I tried several variations, but all had the same result.



Now, I was finally able to use a Puppy Linux that both ASUS and Sony could handle: Puppy Linux 5.7.0 Precise (with the outer space, Earth, and Moon screen). Running Foxtail as usual had two results:

1) Clicking “Foxtail.exe” itself results in “Some of the essential files are missing. Please reinstall.” This happens with both ASUS and Sony.

2) Using the WINE file system and clicking “foxtail.exe” results in the game working on the ASUS but nothing on the Sony.


O.K, this time it’s the same exact Puppy Linux (5.7.0 Precise), using the same exact WINE (1.5.0), and the same exact game (in this case the Foxtail USB stick version). If there is absolutely no connection with Windows when using Puppy Linux and WINE then why doesn’t it work on the Sony? “Foxtail” has lower standards than the more demanding (RAM and processing speed) “Inherit the Earth,” so there is clearly something else here.

When trying to start the game via the command window on the ASUS with Puppy Linux 5.7.0 Precise you get an error message similar at first to the one on the Sony, but then it’s much larger and has many number of “fixme” lines- the game starts anyway, works just fine.


Attempting to do this with Puppy Linux 5.7.0 Precise on the Sony with the command window does call up the game window, along with a WINE error window with that "invisible" content- just the frame- and the whole system is frozen, the computer must be manually switched off.


What is the highest version of WINE that will work with Puppy Linux 5.2.5 Lucid? Why, when I installed WINE (etc.).sfs from Puppy Linux 5.2.5's very own Quickpet, has nothing happened?

Obviously I'm missing something here.


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 Post Posted: Sat Oct 20, 2018 5:52 pm 
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GusCE6 wrote:
Attempting to start the game (it’s in a different place now but your instructions are otherwise followed) results in these:
Code:
# wine start /unix /mnt/sda5/00_ASUS_Games/Foxtail_Offline/foxtail.exe


This was the result:
Code:
# err:module:load_builtin_dll failed to load .so lib for builtin L”winemp3.acm”: libmpg123.so.0: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory
fixme:win:EnumDisplayDevicesW (L”\\\\.\\DISPLAY1“,0,0x33f430,0x00000000), stub!
Xlib:  extension “GLX” missing on display “:0.0“.
err:wgl:X11DRV_WineGL_InitOpenglInfo  couldn’t initialize OpenGL, expect problems



You are missing a native package, called mpg123 (or similar).

So you have no OpenGL hardware or software rendering support. No 3D games will work, as a result.
What's the output from:
Code:
glxinfo | egrep '^[[:alpha:]]'


GusCE6 wrote:
Gingetips sent me the file “settings.xml” which has the following code:
blah... blah


Wine either leverages your native OpenGL support to provide all support Windows OpenGL and DirectX (<=11) support.
So broken native Linux OpenGL support = broken Wine OpenGL and DirectX support, for Windows applications.

GusCE6 wrote:
Trying this:
Code:
/mnt/sda5/00_ASUS_Games/Foxtail_Offline/



Why are trying this? You can't run a directory!

GusCE6 wrote:
Code:
sudo lsblk -o HCTL,KNAME,MODEL,REV,FSTYPE,SIZE,UUID,LABEL,MOUNTPOINT



Results in:

Code:
bash: sudo: command not found



That command just needs to be run as root, so no sudo support - then just run:
Code:
su root -c 'lsblk -o HCTL,KNAME,MODEL,REV,FSTYPE,SIZE,UUID,LABEL,MOUNTPOINT'

Sorry, the quote snuck in there, from my BASH alias!


GusCE6 wrote:
O.K, this time it’s the same exact Puppy Linux (5.7.0 Precise), using the same exact WINE (1.5.0), and the same exact game (in this case the Foxtail USB stick version). If there is absolutely no connection with Windows when using Puppy Linux and WINE then why doesn’t it work on the Sony? “Foxtail” has lower standards than the more demanding (RAM and processing speed) “Inherit the Earth,” so there is clearly something else here.


Wine is pretty disconnected from Windows. Although dynamic link libraries (dll's) marked as native (Windows) will run as native machine code.
Wine will simply intercept and translate the Windows API calls, these libraries make.

Wine doesn't directly implement very much, instead it acts as a bridge / translation layer between what the Windows application requests (via Windows API calls) and what libraries your GNU/Linux system provides (pulseaudio/alsa sound system, OpenGL graphics, X, gstreamer A/V, freetype font rendering).
If the Linux side of that translation is missing bits... Then you get to pick up the pieces! :lol:

Bob


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 Post Posted: Mon Oct 22, 2018 6:59 pm 
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Bob,

First, thank you so much for the help here- you don't know how it feels to actually have a competent person willing to help with a technical problem!

Briefly, whether you use WINE 1.3.3 or 1.5.0 games like Deepica will not run at all unless you drop in Swiftshader 2.1 files (d3d8.dll and d3d9.dll along with the swiftshader.ini file)- just like when running it in XP mode. If you try you get the "Need DirectX 8.1) error window. For some reason with WINE 1.5.0 most of the games that do work do not have screens, just "invisible" screens with frames, even with Swiftshader included.

Swiftshader was meant for old computers that lacked something for games, and games like Deepica, Ancient Wonderland, Plumeboom, Inherit the Earth, and others only run with them.

The curious thing is that absolutely any game that did not run on XP mode will not run with Puppy Linux WINE mode, no exceptions. With Puppy Linux 5.7.0 Precise more run, but so sluggishly you must wait for a long time to just start the game, and Undertale Demo has only a portion of the playfield showing. These problems do not exist with the ASUS. But Undertale Demo runs fine in XP mode.

I'll try to find that missing library and figure out how to install it. At least it's a start. Hopefully Puppy Linux 5.2.5 Lucid can install any missing libraries needed, and they won't bog the whole works down as with 5.7.0 Precise (which otherwise works fine except when running WINE and games).

As for that directory- run- sorry, I misunderstood what you meant and thought it was some sort of directory redirect.

Again, thank you. :)


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 Post Posted: Tue Oct 23, 2018 5:17 pm 
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Trying both of those code lines resulted in "Command not found" error messages- they do not work.


If OpenGL is not installed, is there any way to do it here? Where would I get it, and how would it be installed?


More on "Swiftshader:" Swiftshader was made for computers that lack certain graphics abilities, or were not quite up to it. In the Sony, as well as with WINE, you can find these files but they simply do not get the job done for most games, which is why you get those "Missing Direct X" error messages.

Dropping the Swiftshader files in the same folder as the EXE file does help some of the games, such as Deepica. However, with WINE 1.5.0 only a couple of games work (except for most included XP games such as Pinball and Freecell), and games like Deepica show no visuals. WINE 1.3.3 work with more games, but not Firefox. Since the main idea is to use Puppy Linux for browsing (safety) this won't do.

Here is a list of some games that Swiftshader gets running on the Sony, games that did not work before:


Deepica/Golden Path of Plumeboom (same game, different look and sound)

Fiber Twig Midnight Puzzle

Ancient Wonderland

Sid Meier's Pirates! 2K (but with some serious speed problems, still, this Direct X 9.c game works)

Elementals: the Magic Key (before it had several error messages)

Plumeboom: the First Chapter

Half-Life

Inherit the Earth


But even with Swiftshader most of these games do not work with Puppy Linux 5.2.5 and WINE- but they absolutely do with regular XP mode.


Using one of the WINE SFS files resulted in nothing, another did get the FILE and CONFIG on the menu- but without a WINE PET file installed absolutely nothing happened, just a "directory/file not found" error message.

I'm starting to catch on a bit here, but there's quite a ways to go clearly.


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 Post Posted: Wed Oct 24, 2018 1:20 pm 
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UPDATE:


I took the opengl32.dll file from the DOSBox folder, dropped it in the Foxtail folder, and then typed in:


Code:
wine start /unix /mnt/sda5/00_ASUS_Games/Foxtail_Offline/foxtail.exe



This was the result:


Code:
# fixme:ver:GetCurrentPackageId (0x33f01c (nil)): stub
Xlib:  extension “GLX” missing on display “:0.0“.
err:wgl:X11DRV_WineGL_InitOpenglInfo  couldn’t initialize OpenGL, expect problems
fixme:win:RegisterTouchWindow (0x10052 00000003): stub
err:ntdll:RtlLeaveCriticalSection section 0x360438 is not acquired



This is different from before. How does one “install” OpenGL into a Puppy Linux system or WINE if it is possible?



Based on your earlier comment I checked for a more recent WINE, and in this case found 2.4. It does not work at all.

If one adds a WINE SFS file (in this case 1.7)...nothing happens except menu entries that do nothing.

However, if the SFS file is “set up” AND THEN the 2.4 PET file installed you do get both file and config, but none of those extra goodies which I don't use anyway.

The result is that the games and apps that worked before- including DOSBox!- now work, as well as PC Mozilla Firefox 40!


The only problem here is that the sound from DOSBox is somewhat sputtering. I’ll have to find out how to adjust these things, adjusting the speed (CTRL+F11 and CTRL+F12) has little effect. But the DOS games do run on Puppy Linux 5.2.5 now. Thanks, Bob, for putting me on the right track there.


It should be noted that under WINE “Libraries” there are many more options, SDL2 not among them, but it seems that no more EXE files run than before. My only guess based on the results of WINE 1.5 on the mighty ASUS is the Sony itself since “Foxtail” will not run in either XP or Puppy Linux mode, even when distro and WINE apps are identical. Something is missing.

But at last things are being accomplished by this beginner. And it's thanks to people like the ones here!


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 Post Posted: Wed Oct 24, 2018 3:27 pm 
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Sorry again...having trouble with the wifi and library's sign-in pages...

The sound has been adjusted via the .conf file, although moving the cursor around still causes some trouble. But it's not nearly as bad as before at least. Presumably the low RAM on that Sony and the way DOSBox and Puppy Linux 5.2.5 Lucid work is a factor since this does not happen in XP mode- but the fact remains that Javascript, SWF and MS-DOS games now run on a 2001 Sony in Puppy Linux mode along with several EXE games and some useful Windows PC applications, QTWeb browser among them.

To be honest, "Foxtail" is really the only thing bothering me. If that can be made to run on that old laptop, given what else runs in XP mode (it's a Dual-Operating System), and the fact it can browse in reasonable safety since Puppy Linux is much less vulnerable to viruses and the like, I'd actually be quite satisfied.

But Puppy Linux and WINE are just so interesting I'd like to learn more about it- for example, what advantages would there be with WINE 3.0 as opposed to WINE 2.4 in getting games to run on the same system?


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 Post Posted: Thu Oct 25, 2018 2:08 am 
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GusCE6 wrote:
Sorry again...having trouble with the wifi and library's sign-in pages...

The sound has been adjusted via the .conf file, although moving the cursor around still causes some trouble. But it's not nearly as bad as before at least. Presumably the low RAM on that Sony and the way DOSBox and Puppy Linux 5.2.5 Lucid work is a factor since this does not happen in XP mode- but the fact remains that Javascript, SWF and MS-DOS games now run on a 2001 Sony in Puppy Linux mode along with several EXE games and some useful Windows PC applications, QTWeb browser among them.

To be honest, "Foxtail" is really the only thing bothering me. If that can be made to run on that old laptop, given what else runs in XP mode (it's a Dual-Operating System), and the fact it can browse in reasonable safety since Puppy Linux is much less vulnerable to viruses and the like, I'd actually be quite satisfied.


I'd argue any Operating System that isn't getting security updates, / is EOL, is not really safe to connect to the Internet.
Puppy Linux 5.2.5 was released in 2011 (following the Ubuntu Lucid release in 2010). It was EOL years ago.
If you're going to hook up an OS to the Internet, in 2018, it needs to be up-to-date with security patches.
Especially so, if you are using Public WiFi.

My understanding was that Puppy Linux is targetted a live session usage, rather than installation (similar to Knoppix).
So you quickly start running into a lack of basic packages. E.g. I would expect all modern Linux distributions to have the lsblk utility available.
Perhaps you'd be better off using a plain X Session on top of the Ubuntu net-installer or (simpler) Lubuntu?

GusCE6 wrote:
But Puppy Linux and WINE are just so interesting I'd like to learn more about it- for example, what advantages would there be with WINE 3.0 as opposed to WINE 2.4 in getting games to run on the same system?


Wine Development / Staging (currently 3.18) is required to get the Valve Steam Client working.
Even the most recent Wine Stable release (3.0.3) does not currently support this application.

For older games, without a rolling-release Digital Download manager to bugger things up, you should be OK!
However if you update your OS, then it quickly becomes impossible to use older, binary-packaged versions of Wine.
The system library versions old Wine builds link against, will be out-of-date.

Wine will never completely implement all of the Windows API.
So it's more of a question of does it correctly satisfy all of the critical API calls that your application makes?


GusCE6 wrote:
This is different from before. How does one “install” OpenGL into a Puppy Linux system or WINE if it is possible?


As I've already stated Wine maps Windows API calls to native Linux API calls.
Windows OpenGL calls are directly mapped, by Wine, to native OpenGL calls.
Windows DirectX 7-11 calls are translated to native OpenGL commands, by Wine.

This is why I previously asked for:
Code:
glxinfo | egrep '^[[:alpha:]]'

Alternatively the inxi utility output would probably suffice:
Code:
inxi -G

To check the state of play, with you native Linux graphics stack.

Bob


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 Post Posted: Thu Oct 25, 2018 6:27 am 
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Bob Wya wrote:
GusCE6 wrote:
This is different from before. How does one “install” OpenGL into a Puppy Linux system or WINE if it is possible?


As I've already stated Wine maps Windows API calls to native Linux API calls.
Windows OpenGL calls are directly mapped, by Wine, to native OpenGL calls.
Windows DirectX 7-11 calls are translated to native OpenGL commands, by Wine.
Bob


To be explicit, one installs OpenGL in one's distro, not in Wine. Wine uses it to run OpenGL and DirectX apps/games, and they will not work without it. As for installing it on Puppy, that seems to have been a problem for Puppy users for years. Googling "puppy opengl" did turn up this post, which is old, but the answer may still be valid. If not, you really need to ask on the Puppy forum about what package to install.


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 Post Posted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 4:47 pm 
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Well, in a way any Linux system with WINE could be considered much more vulnerable to attack.

Windows is still by far the most common Operating System out there, in fact it's been said that in 2018 more people still use XP than iOS!

Therefore the most obvious target for attack would be Windows. But how does a virus work? Can a virus from 1998 attack a Windows 7 system? Not likely (barring a common feature), because of course Windows 7 did not exist and viruses and applications are not psychic. A virus is a sort of nasty uninvited application. If it attacks Windows it was designed to attack Windows. This is one thing that helped make Linux so much safer: fewer hackers were after it.

But if WINE increasingly makes Windows stuff work more and more on Linux then logically it presents a doorway into the whole works. If someone wants to be safer he should not use WINE at all so he has a pure Linux/Puppy Linux setup.


When I go online the way Puppy Linux is put on the ASUS and Sony alike is in TWO forms: Save File and No Save. I use the No Save version so when I'm finished with whatever I'm doing nothing changed will be saved. It's not 100% (what is really?) but it surely helps.

I tried those two lines in the Command Window but both gave back a "command not found" error message. Neither works.


I also installed Xorg_High, and have gotten some strange results, none of them helping with anything. However, installing that WINE 1.7 SFS and WINE 2.4 PET files does get a request to download something having to do with ".net." I know about this with XP, so maybe that's significant here, I'll try it.

But now a form of OpenGL is mentioned in one of the system scans. It just hasn't helped with anything yet. Curiously, setting the Sony's graphics to 24-Bit in XP mode only causes some problems, it has NEVER accomplished anything good. Ever. So if there is a way to get the display in Puppy Linux back to 16-Bit without uninstalling Xorg_High that may be a huge help.

But it is weird that "Inherit the Earth" works so well in both modes- heck, even with Puppy Linux 5.7.0 Precise- but "Foxtail" will not in either mode.


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